The Iron Lady...........Rust in Peace..

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The Iron Lady...........Rust in Peace..

Postby Philshoz » Sun Apr 14, 2013 7:46 am

What do we all think about the death of Maggie Thatcher?

Is a state funeral justified, costing millions of pounds.

What is her legacy...........good, bad, don't care............. :?: :?:
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Re: The Iron Lady...........Rust in Peace..

Postby Craivold » Sun Apr 14, 2013 8:06 am

This is a bit political for in 'ere isn't it Phil? We can't talk about politics or religion, it'll only end in tears :lol: . Plenty of interesting views been flying around twitter on this though, she definitely divided opinion. I was born in 84 so dont really remember her influence from experience but I think it was cool she managed to bust through as the first female PM but she didn't actually seem to do much on the sexual equality issue whilst she was in power which is still an issue today in many businesses around 20 years after she was in charge. And as PM she seemed to have done what most Tory leaders would have done in charge, sell off government organisations/institutions...

Really don't understand why a state funeral is required, apparently going to set the tax payers back £8m or so.... WTF?! Don't know anyone who is wanting to go to or watch the funeral, pointless IMO.
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Re: The Iron Lady...........Rust in Peace..

Postby mountain man » Sun Apr 14, 2013 8:22 am

Regardless of political inclinations, anyone celebrating the death of another is pretty fucking sad. She's receiving more abuse in the UK than the likes of Saddam and Bin Laden had on their deaths!
Organising and attending death parties? Go surfing instead.
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Re: The Iron Lady...........Rust in Peace..

Postby Vince Noir » Sun Apr 14, 2013 8:37 am

i'm fed up of hearing about her and it dominating every news story on the radio and internet

state funeral....as if her family havent got enough money to pay for her own fucking funeral
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Re: The Iron Lady...........Rust in Peace..

Postby Werwulf1919 » Sun Apr 14, 2013 9:36 am

She was a nasty piece of work...same as the rest of the tory bastards.
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Re: The Iron Lady...........Rust in Peace..

Postby Paul C » Sun Apr 14, 2013 9:41 am

That evil woman destroyed a lot of decent working peoples' lives and a lot of them never recovered, even now.

Also there was the poll tax!

Piss on her fucking grave!
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Re: The Iron Lady...........Rust in Peace..

Postby Black » Sun Apr 14, 2013 10:05 am

It surprises me that anyone has a good word to say about her. She didn't believe in society so why should it pay for her funeral?
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Re: The Iron Lady...........Rust in Peace..

Postby swiggy » Sun Apr 14, 2013 4:17 pm

It is ironic that she would want the state to pay for her. This surely makes her one of the welfare/benefits recipient that she hated so much?
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Re: The Iron Lady...........Rust in Peace..

Postby roberdy » Sun Apr 14, 2013 4:34 pm

Right-o lads, anyone starts with disrespectful, malicious or just bloody nasty comments and this thread will be in "caught inside" faster than you can fall off your surfboard!

As it is I am moving this to non surf chat....
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Re: The Iron Lady...........Rust in Peace..

Postby swiggy » Sun Apr 14, 2013 4:50 pm

How about some jokes?

When I realised Margaret Thatcher was dead, I did a double fist pump and shouted, "Fucking brilliant!"
Everyone around me was disgusted, and looking back, I suppose it was out of order.
Especially as I was the first paramedic at the scene.



What's the difference between Margaret Thatcher and Michael Jackson?
Margaret Thatcher didn't like miners.


"There is no such thing as society" - Margaret Thatcher, 1988
"There is no such thing as Margaret Thatcher" - Society, 2013


Margaret Thatcher's final wish was to be cremated.
Unfortunately, we've no coal left


Just like Margaret Thatcher, I refer to my girlfriend as "The Iron Lady"
She is also known as "The Cook Lady", "The Cleaning Lady", "The Wash Lady"
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Re: The Iron Lady...........Rust in Peace..

Postby ATTMFKH » Sun Apr 14, 2013 5:34 pm

.
Are We Too Deep ...............
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Re: The Iron Lady...........Rust in Peace..

Postby Leven » Sun Apr 14, 2013 8:11 pm

She also stood up to the IRA, defended the Falklands, and got rid of coal before it ran out, so perhaps not all bad?

I do wonder if the same street party mentality would be shown if Gordon Brown/Tony Blair died? After all, they're responsible for the biggest debt in history, countless soldiers lives in wars we've no business being a part of etc etc.


Just thought I'd try and throw a bit of balance into the mix! And no, I'm not a Tory!!
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Re: The Iron Lady...........Rust in Peace..

Postby roberdy » Sun Apr 14, 2013 9:17 pm

Leven wrote:She also stood up to the IRA, defended the Falklands, and got rid of coal before it ran out, so perhaps not all bad?


Eh? there fecking loads of coal under the UK, what do you think they want to frack to get nice clean coal seam gas out of? (well there's shales as well but that notwithstanding there's still loads of bloody coal!)

Maggie boosted north sea gas so much as an alternate to coal so she could break the TUC (as one of the three main unions trying to control industry in the UK at the time). I don't agree with the way it was done but she wasn't THE government, she was just the leader, we forget there was a whole cabinet around her, supporting and driving her vision.

I don't think the UK would have survived without becoming a more finance and services oriented economy anyway, we are unable to compete with the emerging economies and have been unable since the mid to late 80's, coincidentally about the same time the Maggie was in power.... It's shit for most of the UK because the conversion from heavy industry to services meant that the jobs and the money shifted became polarised in the south east.

Where we do still succeed is in top end engineering, we have some of the best in the world I reckon and there are still some industries that continue but they have done so by adding value and building in the services as well as the industrial output.

Things are slowly changing as it becomes possible to conduct business more remotely, I have a friend back home in St Agnes who runs a hi-tech consultancy doing work for some pretty big clients. They can achieve it because they offer high spec services using high bandwidth connections, he is also involved in pushing for 20mb broadband in Kernow which will make it even more accessible. Damn if it weren't for my own plans I would think about moving back!

Anyway, Maggie is dead, my condolences to her family.
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Re: The Iron Lady...........Rust in Peace..

Postby briggfoot » Sun Apr 14, 2013 10:00 pm

Black wrote:It surprises me that anyone has a good word to say about her.


Have a watch of this then: http://www.channel4.com/programmes/marg ... ionary/4od
A few points that stuck with me, (from memory, might be wrong....)

She turned the British economy from one of the least productive in Europe to the best performing, in just a few years.

She cut the national debt in half.

She strapped on a pair, and called 'time' on industries that were being kept alive *artificially* on state subsidies, and were not a viable option of the future.

She was instrumental in bringing about the end of the Cold War and avoiding something that could have been a lot worse, and in the defeat of Communism, and all that Berlin Wall malarky....

She put an end to the unions constantly holding the country to ransom with strike action and in-activity, and made it possible for union members to elect their leaders etc.

For all the flack she took from the opposition, they didn't try and reverse many of her decisions...

She was a working class, girl, that got in to Oxford at a time when working class girls didn't do that type of thimg, and went on to lead the country as the longest serving British Prime Minister.

I'm not into politics usually, and can see how decisive and ruthless many might see her as, but that program (Margaret = A revolutionary) was an eye-opener to the other side of the story when the popular narrative is that she was "wicked/nasty/responsible for X, Y Z.... etc etc," it's good to hear the other sides of the story.
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Re: The Iron Lady...........Rust in Peace..

Postby Kamikaze » Mon Apr 15, 2013 11:48 am

Like all politicians she did some good and some bad. When she came to power the country was in a right state, and she was the only one that had the balls to sort it out. Now don't get me wrong, the effect on the lives of the miners etc affected was dreadful, but by the same token what they were doing to the uk was also dreadful. And I'm sure there were other ways that the problem could have been dealt with, but no one yet seems to have come up with a satisfactory one that I've heard.

Don't forget the Left had a choice, they could have sorted all this out, if they had she would not have got into power in the first place, but the couldn't/wouldn't. Partly because all their funding came from said unions and partly because of complete spinelessness.

Also as a harcore comunist (well i think he was) Scargill took everyone out on strike to try and bring the government down, how far do you think he'd have got with that in a communist country? How well do you think Russia treated its miners back then?

The biggest trouble with maggie was that she seemed to go insane after the first two terms, the poll tax was a fiasco (amongst others) and she surrounded herself with useless cnuts in the cabinet.

It would be interesting to know where we would be now if she hadn't got the job, would/could anyone else have sorted the issues? Labour certainly weren't going to, and who else in the tory party at the time had the guts/wherewithal. And if no one sorted it where would we be now?


I think Reginald D Hunter does a good job of summing her up.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3nALKwhA7Ro
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Re: The Iron Lady...........Rust in Peace..

Postby Chris F » Mon Apr 15, 2013 1:52 pm

Plus side, she gave Spitting Image some great material to work with!

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Re: The Iron Lady...........Rust in Peace..

Postby Kamikaze » Wed Apr 17, 2013 11:28 am

Chris F wrote:Plus side, she gave Spitting Image some great material to work with!



One of Spitting images finest moments:-

Waiter:- And what would madam like.
Thatcher:- Oh I'll have the steak, raw.
Waiter:- Very good madam. And the vegetables?
Thatcher:- Oh they'll have the same.
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Re: The Iron Lady...........Rust in Peace..

Postby Chris F » Wed Apr 17, 2013 11:49 am

roberdy wrote:
Leven wrote:She also stood up to the IRA, defended the Falklands, and got rid of coal before it ran out, so perhaps not all bad?


Eh? there fecking loads of coal under the UK, what do you think they want to frack to get nice clean coal seam gas out of? (well there's shales as well but that notwithstanding there's still loads of bloody coal!)



I'm still awaiting an explanation of how she "got rid of coal"? The collieries could have still been ongoing economically viable businesses now without her.
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Re: The Iron Lady...........Rust in Peace..

Postby briggfoot » Wed Apr 17, 2013 5:37 pm

Chris F wrote:The collieries could have still been ongoing economically viable businesses now without her.


Reaally??
One thing that strikes me as weird about the anti-thatcher protests from the miners:

Number of coal mines open during the Labour Govt in the years before Thatcher:
1964 .. 545
1965 .. 504
1966 .. 442
1967 .. 406
1968 .. 330
1969 .. 304
1974 .. 250
1975 .. 241
1976 .. 239
1977 .. 231
1978 .. 223
1979 .. 219


And the figures for the Thatcher years:

1979 .. 219
1980 .. 213
1981 .. 200
1982 .. 191
1983 .. 170
1984 .. 169
1985 .. 133
1986 .. 110
1987 .. 94
1988 .. 86
1989 .. 73
1990 .. 65

So why weren't the miners screaming under Labour before Thatcher?!
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Re: The Iron Lady...........Rust in Peace..

Postby Leedsol » Wed Apr 17, 2013 7:03 pm

briggfoot wrote:
Chris F wrote:The collieries could have still been ongoing economically viable businesses now without her.


Reaally??
One thing that strikes me as weird about the anti-thatcher protests from the miners:

Number of coal mines open during the Labour Govt in the years before Thatcher:
1964 .. 545
1965 .. 504
1966 .. 442
1967 .. 406
1968 .. 330
1969 .. 304
1974 .. 250
1975 .. 241
1976 .. 239
1977 .. 231
1978 .. 223
1979 .. 219


And the figures for the Thatcher years:

1979 .. 219
1980 .. 213
1981 .. 200
1982 .. 191
1983 .. 170
1984 .. 169
1985 .. 133
1986 .. 110
1987 .. 94
1988 .. 86
1989 .. 73
1990 .. 65

So why weren't the miners screaming under Labour before Thatcher?!


Err, they were. Brought down a succession of Governments in the 1970s hence the stockpiling of cheap imported subsisdised (read workers in poor countries working in perilous conditions so we benefit from their shit existence) coal to enable the 1980s strike to have little effect on the wider public.

To be fair all parties in the episode were wankers but the zeal in which the Govt of the day sought to decimate workers outside the South East so they could not hold the country to ransom again as they did in the 70s was nothing more than class war at a time when people could only withdraw their labour for better working conditions. I know scores of people who have died from industrial diseases working for the benefit of all of us in the country
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Re: The Iron Lady...........Rust in Peace..

Postby Leven » Wed Apr 17, 2013 7:38 pm

It does surprise me how many people criticise the closure of coal mines, despite the fact that they were heavily subsidised, and losing money hand over fist. If it doesn't break even, why should it be subsidised? That said, I suppose to a degree, you could talk about modern banks in the same way...massive losses, and bailed out. Can you imagine the criticism if they weren't bailed out?


Guess you can't please all of the people all of the time....
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Re: The Iron Lady...........Rust in Peace..

Postby Black » Wed Apr 17, 2013 8:19 pm

I've got mixed feelings about the mines, yes all involved share the responsibility. The mines were not just a profit/loss-making industry though, they produced most of the electricity for the Uk (via power stations of course) and that can't be looked at simply in the terms of profit and loss, also they were the basis of whole communities, rightly or wrongly. Thatcher hacked off a goitre and was left with a bloody mess, still raw!
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