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Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 7:09 am
by reserves
I’m considering a Patagonia Wetsuit after having an awful experience with the Xcel Drylock (worst suit i’ve Owned).

Looking at the temperature guide it would seem the R3 would get me through this winter in North Devon.

However reading Secretspots wetsuit guide they talk about the R4.

I’m going to get the hooded version as i’ll be surfing a lot more this winter and want to be warm but obviously flexibility is important too.

I wear a 4/3 Flashbomb and do love how flexible Rip Curl suits are, just struggle with the fit as I’m between small and medium.

Also wondering if people would recommend the latest Patagonia suits but mainly should I be considering the R3 or R4?

Cheers

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 11:57 pm
by MarekReiser
If it's a matter of flexibility, there is no big difference between R3 and R4 for me. For the windy winter they are both with hoods, so don't worry. You lived the worst experience, every following one will be better :P

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Mon Oct 02, 2017 3:04 pm
by reserves
Answering my own question, R4 for winter for sure, water temp of 9 degrees is fine with the R3 but as correctly told me I'd not considered wind factor etc.

Looked at 3 suits, the R4, the Flashbomb 6/4 and the ONeill Pyscho Tech FZ 6/4 Hooded Wetsuit

The O' Neill looked great for the price compared for the others.

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Tue Oct 03, 2017 1:51 pm
by BoredatWork925
I would say that the most important thing is fit, especially with a winter suit.

Regarding what you need for what temperature, those guides you see are highly misleading because everyone differs so much. I use a 5/3 in a UK summer, whereas most use a 3/2 and some even less; so for example if anyone asks what suit they 'should' use in a UK summer, what's the answer?..

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 9:19 am
by Philchapman
Just boredies for the summer.

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 10:06 am
by reserves
Thanks all, I'm not sure why I didn't see your post Marek before I posted back.

@Phil I'm not sure where you're surfing but boardies would be nice all year round, it's taken me this long to move to Devon, now I'll work on moving somewhere hot....

@BoardatWork agreed, I don't usually feel the cold *unless* my wetsuit is crap, so it's hard to say, sometimes you get in and the water is freezing for no logical reason too (well I'm sure there's logic but I don't know what it is)

I'll try the suits on a see, hopefully the O'neill wetsuits one is a good fit as it's £120 cheaper than all the others and seems to be very good.

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 11:04 am
by Philchapman
I was just being facetious. Sorry. I'm just a normal guy in Cornwall who uses a 3/2 in summer and a 5/3 in winter.

Unless they've made it colder, an R4 would be overkill outside of Jan/Feb, and unless they've made it warmer an R3 will be too cold in Jan/Feb.
For me that is.

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 11:25 am
by BoredatWork925
Phil: :-D That's ok, I realised! I have seen people in boardies in the UK though :shock:

Reserves: Lots of things make your experience of temperature vary. Sometimes if the sun beats down on a sandy beach it can warm the water above it quite a lot compared with deeper water, and sometimes if it's a cold cloudy day at a reasonable time of year the water can seem much warmer than it actually is. You also get currents and storms etc bringing in colder water. Air temperature, sun and wind play a part too. The trick is learning what you need for each type of weather.

As a general rule, with windsurfing (the sport I have most experience with) I don't go in the water at all from Christmas to Easter, then I use a 6/5 until June-ish, a 5/3 all summer until early Oct and the 6/5 again until Christmas. I have a short sleeved 4/3 that I use windsurfing if it's an absolute scorcher, but I doubt I'd ever surf in it. I'm new to surfing, so still finding out how this will vary, but it seems similar so far. My wife is basically a step down from that: similar to Phil above.

The reason I'm mentioning all this is that everyone's different and you need to find out what you need. One thing I will say is that I've never actually been warm in the sea anywhere in the world; I just change my suit so I get more flexibility and comfort.

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 11:26 am
by Philshoz
Philchapman wrote:I'm just a normal guy in Cornwall who uses a 3/2 in summer and a 5/3 in winter.

.


Lightweight.. :P what's wrong with a 4/3?

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 12:14 pm
by Philchapman
Eeet ees okay pour la vous all zee way down zouf in zee franche, but I do wear a 5/3 for the colder months (jan/feb/mar) and a 4/3 outside of those months, so there!

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 1:13 pm
by reserves
Cheers for all the comments.

Seems that shops local to me in Croyde / Braunton are stocking 6/4 hooded and skipping the 5/3 hooded options, they must be doing this for a reason. I've never had a 6/4 and never thought I'd need one, usually my feet / hands get cold first and I've rarely got out of the water for being too cold generally, even in the Drylock (ugh)

Guess as I'll be surfing more this winter the last thing I want to worry about is being cold, so was thinking the warmer the better, too many options!

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 2:27 pm
by BoredatWork925
reserves wrote:Seems that shops local to me in Croyde / Braunton are stocking 6/4 hooded and skipping the 5/3 hooded options, they must be doing this for a reason.
I guess they're the most popular option for that area in winter. It's such a popular area for surfing that I suspect they get plenty of customer feedback about what to stock. People also may be spending longer in the water in Croyde because it is such a popular surfing location and attracts more serious and dedicated surfers.

I've never understood surfing and diving with their temperature charts. You don't get this with other sports - running and hiking websites don't try and dictate what you wear to run or hike in the winter; they just sell a range of stuff for a range of people's needs.

One thing I would say is not to underestimate the importance of fit, not just for keeping you warm, but also for flexibility. I was stunned when I got my first custom made suit; it's a 6/5 but more flexible than plenty of thinner suits I've tried, simply because I'm not constantly stretching and compressing it when I move.

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2017 4:14 pm
by Leven
A 6/4 for winter in the SW is overkill surely? Even on the rare frosty days with an E wind, I can't see how you'd ever need any more than 5mm.

My Finisterre is 4.5mm, and I'll regularly take my hood down in winter. Never been cold in it yet, even in Scotland in November. Cheaper than Patagucci and Xcel by a considerable distance too.

Warmer the better is all well and good, but unless you're having 5 hour sessions, I cant see how you'd ever need to go that thick.

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2017 9:36 pm
by BoredatWork925
Leven wrote:A 6/4 for winter in the SW is overkill surely? Even on the rare frosty days with an E wind, I can't see how you'd ever need any more than 5mm.

My Finisterre is 4.5mm, and I'll regularly take my hood down in winter. Never been cold in it yet, even in Scotland in November. Cheaper than Patagucci and Xcel by a considerable distance too.

Warmer the better is all well and good, but unless you're having 5 hour sessions, I cant see how you'd ever need to go that thick.


I'd say that's about right. Even if I'm at an extreme end of the temperature sensitivity scale, the fact that I'm just switching to my 6/5 now (15-16 deg water temp, 13-15 air) and have to stop around 10/11 degrees at Christmas (and don't start until late April) would suggest that a 6/4 at 6 or 7 degrees in February would be very normal. My 5mm is my summer suit - there's no way I'd use it in winter or spring. All that points towards a 6/4 in the coldest months for the average person being about right?

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 6:31 am
by Philshoz
Leven wrote:A 6/4 for winter in the SW is overkill surely? Even on the rare frosty days with an E wind, I can't see how you'd ever need any more than 5mm.

My Finisterre is 4.5mm, and I'll regularly take my hood down in winter. Never been cold in it yet, even in Scotland in November. Cheaper than Patagucci and Xcel by a considerable distance too.

Warmer the better is all well and good, but unless you're having 5 hour sessions, I cant see how you'd ever need to go that thick.


Leven, does this have an integrated hood? I can't find it on their site.

Also, how is the sizing compared to Ripcurl?

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 8:17 am
by ears
just chipping in my twopennith.. i'm with phil on this one.. I had an R3 albeit a few years ago and I struggled with it on the coldest days in the south west.. fine until Jan but not warm enough after that.. although fine with a polypro vest. I think the R4 is overkill. Just for comparison i was quite happy in a 4/3 hooded dry lock all through winter in the southwest but after surfing the east coast very quickly went 5/3 hooded.. I see no reason for 6mm in the south west.. East coast is a whole different ball game :-D

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 8:17 am
by ears
just chipping in my twopennith.. i'm with phil on this one.. I had an R3 albeit a few years ago and I struggled with it on the coldest days in the south west.. fine until Jan but not warm enough after that.. although fine with a polypro vest. I think the R4 is overkill. Just for comparison i was quite happy in a 4/3 hooded dry lock all through winter in the southwest but after surfing the east coast very quickly went 5/3 hooded.. I see no reason for 6mm in the south west.. East coast is a whole different ball game :-D

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 3:34 pm
by Leven
ears wrote:just chipping in my twopennith.. i'm with phil on this one.. I had an R3 albeit a few years ago and I struggled with it on the coldest days in the south west.. fine until Jan but not warm enough after that.. although fine with a polypro vest. I think the R4 is overkill. Just for comparison i was quite happy in a 4/3 hooded dry lock all through winter in the southwest but after surfing the east coast very quickly went 5/3 hooded.. I see no reason for 6mm in the south west.. East coast is a whole different ball game :-D


Yeah, I had an early Patagonia (with the white wool) and it was horrendous in any cold wind. Used to whistle right through it.


Philshoz wrote:
Leven wrote:A 6/4 for winter in the SW is overkill surely? Even on the rare frosty days with an E wind, I can't see how you'd ever need any more than 5mm.

My Finisterre is 4.5mm, and I'll regularly take my hood down in winter. Never been cold in it yet, even in Scotland in November. Cheaper than Patagucci and Xcel by a considerable distance too.

Warmer the better is all well and good, but unless you're having 5 hour sessions, I cant see how you'd ever need to go that thick.


Leven, does this have an integrated hood? I can't find it on their site.

Also, how is the sizing compared to Ripcurl?



The 5.5mm has a built in hood, the 4.5mm doesn't. I used to be dead set on always having a built in hood, but in the SW you can get away with not having one built in.

Sizing...I don't know about Ripcurl. I'm a MT in Xcel, and a Large in Finisterre. They do come up a little snug in comparison with other brands.

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 4:15 pm
by BoredatWork925
ears wrote:just chipping in my twopennith.. i'm with phil on this one.. I had an R3 albeit a few years ago and I struggled with it on the coldest days in the south west.. fine until Jan but not warm enough after that.. although fine with a polypro vest. I think the R4 is overkill. Just for comparison i was quite happy in a 4/3 hooded dry lock all through winter in the southwest but after surfing the east coast very quickly went 5/3 hooded.. I see no reason for 6mm in the south west.. East coast is a whole different ball game :-D

As I said above, it's highly individual and that won't be the case for everyone. My 5/3 is my summer suit :-D . I'd say to the guy who started the thread to look at what he wears in other months and see how it compares to the numerous charts available online; once you know that offset you're sorted. For example, I wear a 5/3 in August and September and the charts say a 3/2, therefore when the chart says a 5/3, I need a 6/5 or a 7.

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Fri Oct 06, 2017 6:38 pm
by Philshoz
BoredatWork925 wrote:
ears wrote:just chipping in my twopennith.. i'm with phil on this one.. I had an R3 albeit a few years ago and I struggled with it on the coldest days in the south west.. fine until Jan but not warm enough after that.. although fine with a polypro vest. I think the R4 is overkill. Just for comparison i was quite happy in a 4/3 hooded dry lock all through winter in the southwest but after surfing the east coast very quickly went 5/3 hooded.. I see no reason for 6mm in the south west.. East coast is a whole different ball game :-D

As I said above, it's highly individual and that won't be the case for everyone. My 5/3 is my summer suit :-D . I'd say to the guy who started the thread to look at what he wears in other months and see how it compares to the numerous charts available online; once you know that offset you're sorted. For example, I wear a 5/3 in August and September and the charts say a 3/2, therefore when the chart says a 5/3, I need a 6/5 or a 7.


What's your BMI, 17? You sound like a snake!

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 4:28 pm
by Philchapman
2 hours on the hot rocks = 10 mins in the water.

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Sun Oct 08, 2017 9:49 pm
by BoredatWork925
Philshoz wrote:
BoredatWork925 wrote:
ears wrote:just chipping in my twopennith.. i'm with phil on this one.. I had an R3 albeit a few years ago and I struggled with it on the coldest days in the south west.. fine until Jan but not warm enough after that.. although fine with a polypro vest. I think the R4 is overkill. Just for comparison i was quite happy in a 4/3 hooded dry lock all through winter in the southwest but after surfing the east coast very quickly went 5/3 hooded.. I see no reason for 6mm in the south west.. East coast is a whole different ball game :-D

As I said above, it's highly individual and that won't be the case for everyone. My 5/3 is my summer suit :-D . I'd say to the guy who started the thread to look at what he wears in other months and see how it compares to the numerous charts available online; once you know that offset you're sorted. For example, I wear a 5/3 in August and September and the charts say a 3/2, therefore when the chart says a 5/3, I need a 6/5 or a 7.


What's your BMI, 17? You sound like a snake!


:-D 23! My fat percentage is pretty low though and I'm fairly skinny. It's partly my skinniness, but also just that I feel the cold, everyone just varies on that front. I know quite a few people like me who wear 5mm suits in a UK summer, which is why I mentioned it. Bear in mind that all triathlon suits are 5mm.... the terms 'winter' and 'summer' for wetsuits are rather arbitrary in my opinion.

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Mon Oct 09, 2017 1:35 pm
by Philchapman
Actually, not all tri suits are 5mm.

Yours, Mr. pedantic.

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Mon Oct 09, 2017 4:21 pm
by Black
Mankini with fur lining for winter, without fur in summer.
Next.........

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 9:01 am
by Vince Noir
if youre cold in an Xcel drylock youre doing something wrong. Are you sure it fits properly, as they are top end suits and they are most definitely not going to be cold unless they dont fit or they have a defect somewhere.

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 9:01 am
by Vince Noir
if youre cold in an Xcel drylock youre doing something wrong. Are you sure it fits properly, as they are top end suits and they are most definitely not going to be cold unless they dont fit or they have a defect somewhere.

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 9:16 am
by reserves
Vince Noir wrote:if youre cold in an Xcel drylock youre doing something wrong. Are you sure it fits properly, as they are top end suits and they are most definitely not going to be cold unless they dont fit or they have a defect somewhere.


I wasn't cold in it, just had loads of problems with it, the chest zip kept coming open in the water, the suit gave me rashes under the arm and the Celliant lining itched like hell. Also found it heavy and not as flexible as previous winter suits, but I already had the hump with it by then.

Wasn't helped by the warranty people not communicating, they had the suit for 6 weeks and sent it back with no note, or anything and as far as I could tell they hadn't done anything to it.

My gloves were Xcel too and they split but I think there was a problem with that model in general.

Luckily the retailer looked after me, but I won't be buying Xcel from now on in.

I've never has any wetsuit warranty issues previously, I brought Xcel as people on here raved about them, perhaps a one off but plenty of other options available.

Re: Patagonia R3 or R4 for UK winter?

PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2017 12:37 pm
by Vince Noir
rashes under the arms is likely to be the fit of the suit, ive had it with every suit ive owned.